CZ P-10C - 1200 & 400 rounds, stippling and modification testing.

Dueling P-10Cs

While my black P-10C was on loan to TR Holsters, I procured a second one in flat dark earth.  I put a quick 200 rounds through the FDE before taking at home.  I noticed three differences from my black one.  First, the trigger felt much rougher, and the wall was farther back in the trigger guard, with a spongier break.  It also had a hair longer reset but less over-travel.  The black one shipped with a 6lb 1oz trigger, while the FDE was lighter, about 5lb 8oz.  I polished the mating surfaces and the trigger improved to 5lb 3oz, exactly the same weight as my black P-10C, though the wall, break, and reset remained unchanged.  The mag release is stiffer even after polishing the contact surfaces, but not enough to matter.  The slide release spring is also bent differently.  It pushes down on the slide release a lot harder, hard enough to pop the rail insert out of the frame when detail stripping.  It also takes a little more effort to snap into its cutout in the frame insert.  I'm not sure if it's too heavy, or if the black ones is too light.  The FDE one also auto-forwards when you slam home a magazine, while the black one doesn't.  I'll match the springs once I shoot both enough to know which one is better.

I also outfitted my non-EDC mags with CZ +2 extensions.  I had no failures with the extended magazine with either gun.  Prior to stippling the FDE, I partially bobbed the bottom of the medium back strap to help my shirt flow past it.

34+2 rounds of 9mm

I decided that while the factory grip texture provides plenty of traction, I still prefer a fine 360 degree stipple.  I broke out my 25-watt wood burner and started masking off the edges.  I like to leave the tang smooth, so I can easily slide my hand up as high as possible when acquiring my grip.  I also leave the bottom of the back strap smooth to let my cover garment slide easily past it.  My favorite tip is a shading point.  The bent angle lets me rest my hand on a bean bag, and I can easily see my work.  Since I'm not pushing straight down, I can lightly tap the surface like I'm telegraphing morse code, producing a fine stipple.  It's about the texture of skateboard tape.  Normally I sand off the existing texture with a dremel, but this time I used a flat tip in the wood burner and melted/smoothed out the bumps.  That was a mistake.  While it made quick work of the nubs, it also fills the gaps with very thin layers of molten plastic.  When stippling, these areas tended to discolor, where as the smooth areas didn't.  I probably wouldn't even notice on the black, but on the FDE, it looks like I just picked it up with dirty hands.  In the grand scheme of things it doesn't really matter.  FDE is going to stain and show dirt due to its light color, and since it's going to be my dedicated training gun, it will spend more than enough time in the dirt, sand, and mud to justify it's appearance.  200 more rounds (400 total) on my now stippled FDE affirmed my preference for stippling, and that the six hours of tedium was worth it.

Dirty stippling

While at TR holsters, Tony wanted to see if a Glock Gen3 guide rod and spring would fit in the P-10C.  He cut down a Glock 17 Gen3 tungsten guide rod, and threw in a 15# Glock 19 recoil spring. After 200 rounds the answer is...probably.  I swapped the 15# spring with an oem 18# Glock 19 spring, but it still felt a little lighter than the factory spring.  If I had to guess, I'd put the P-10 factory spring weight at around 20 pounds.  Still, with Speer Lawman 147gn TMJ, I was getting perfect 4 o'clock ejection and no failures.  I examined the frame and guide rod for wear but found nothing.  Side by side, the factory plastic unit and Glock tungsten rod have the same rod and base diameters, though the metal base is slightly thicker,  The springs are practically identical.  If testing continues to go well, I'll probably switch to a stainless guide rod to keep it IDPA ESP legal.  I'll keep the factory plastic unit in my carry gun since the weapon light already adds enough weight.

Chopped G17 guide rod

Perfect fit with a Glock spring

I did notice that the base of the plastic rod looked a little chewed up.  The base actually rests against a flat area on the frame and doesn't move during firing.  I think it just got a little gouged each time I squeezed it back into its spot on the barrel during assembly.  I'm not worried, but I'll keep an eye on it.

When I get some free time, I'm going to so the same stipple on my black P-10C.  This time I'll cut off the nubs with a razor blade, then sand it smooth before stippling.  I'm still not brave enough to try my hand at edge bordering.  Testing continues, but I can't think of much else to try out.  I've got an IDPA match in two weeks, and I plan to shoot another 1,000 rounds through both guns before I decide to carry one.  I wonder what I'm going to do with my Glocks?

--Update

I finished stippling my black P-10C.  I bought a dental bur (inverted cone bur) so I could try my hand at making hard borders.  I used a Dremel Flex shaft and ran it at high speed on a spare Glock backstrap.  The line I cut looked terrible.  It would take years of practice to get as clean a line as the pros.  I'll stick with a fine stipple border.

Instead of melting or Dremeling off the little blocks of polymer, I cut them off with a razor.  This way, I could go back over with a sanding wheel with no danger of heating up the polymer too much.  I masked out the edges with thin strips of painters tape, then made the borders with a fine point wood burning tip.  I used a large conical tip to fill in the rest with very shallow divots.  The traction is great, though slightly less abrasive than using a fine point to do all of it like on my Glocks.

It's not my best work.  The borders could be cleaner and I should have blended the original grip contours a little more, but I didn't want to reduce the grip size.  From start to finish it took me about three hours, half as long as it took to do the FDE.

TR Holsters IWB, OWB, and RTI Review

TR Holsters OWB and "L" Double Mag Carrier in Kryptek Raid

I have a veritable "shoebox full of holsters" from various companies that I have acquired over the years.  After much trial and error, I've narrowed down my go-to list of holster makers to include G-Code, Armordillo Concealment, CJP Custom Kydex, and Guncraft.  They all make great products, and the latest addition to that list is TR Holsters.

G-Code, Priority 1, Guncraft, Comp-Tac, Raven Concealment, JM Custom,
CJP Custom, Armordillo Concealment, & TR Holsters.

A few months ago I was looking for an RTI compatible, light bearing holster with level II retention for my RMR'd Glock 19 w/ X300U.  This would be used in carbine classes or 2-gun.  While the short answer is Safariland, I couldn't find one in stock so I tried searching on Ebay.  That's where I found TR Holsters.  Normally I would have dismissed them as just another Kydex bender, but I noticed a few features that caught my eye.  The blocking was well defined and I saw nice touches like eyelets for the belt clip mounting screw holes.  Their light bearing IWB did not have rivets or a retention screw going under the light or trigger guard.  It was placed in the front, between the muzzle and light bezel.  This meant it was about 1/2" narrower than the more common style.  They also used stronger metal overhooks instead of injection molded, and had holsters for a large variety of gun/light combos including the Roland Special.  I went to their website and placed an order for a Glock 17/x300U-A, RTI holster with a Blade Tech WRS level 2 retention system in medium grey.  Two weeks later I got a call from Janna at TR Holsters.  Before shipping out my order, she wanted to know if I just wanted to pick it up since they were in Rockwell, NC, about 45 minutes from my home.  Even better, they were 10 minutes from work.  I told her I'd be in pick it up the next day around lunch time.

TR Holsters is owned by Tony Moffre, his wife Janna, and their door greeting dogs, Sam and Otis.  Their operation is run out of a steel warehouse, with a small retail store in front.  Along with their kydex goods, they also stock products from Agency Arms, Streamlight, Surefire, BCM, BRCC, Aimpoint, Trijicon, HSGI, and Magpul.  When I remarked on this, Janna replied with, "We don't sell crap."  When the talk turned to holsters, Tony invited me to the back of the shop where he showed me an impressive array of molds, tooling, and his personal firearms.  He let me handle his Roland Special, as well as his MP5 and a few other NFA goodies.  It's very apparent that Tony is passionate about his business, and the fact that he was willing to let a stranger off the street see his operation demonstrates a high level of confidence and pride in his work.  I went home with my new holster and a few boxes of Black Rifle Coffee.

TR Holsters Workshop

No crap here.

Lots of kydex in stock.

After a few minutes fine tuning the retention screws, my Glock snapped perfectly into the holster.  This holster currently lives on my G-Code Operator Belt along with their excellent Softshell Scorpion mag carriers.  This is my preferred setup for carbine classes.  The RTI mounts are high enough that I don't need a drop hanger to clear my plate carrier, and the level 2 retention gives me the piece of mind to stay focused on running my rifle.

When I needed a Glock/x300U IWB holster, I paid TR another visit.  I purchased an in-stock IWB holster for a Glock 17/TLR, a TLR-1HL, Agency trigger, and a few more boxes of Black Rifle coffee.  The only modification I made was to add a strip of self-adhesive suede to the body side of the holster, and cut off the sweat guard.  I do this with all my IWB holsters for comfort and heat protection.  The following weekend, I used them at Sage Dynamic's 2-day Vehicle Defense class, including the 5-hour drive to Georgia.  Despite drawing from odd positions inside and around vehicles, crawling through doors and under bumpers, sliding in the mud, and getting drenched in the rain, the holster help up perfectly.  Not once did my gun come loose or shift out of position on my belt.  A full AAR of the class here.

The screws aren't rusty, that's just Georgia clay.

When I got my new CZ P-10C, I was disappointed that it doesn't fit the majority of my Glock holsters.  In some, it technically goes all the way in, but never "clicks", it just sort of wedges itself, relying on friction for retention.  The exception was with my light bearing holster.  Since it uses the light for retention, the P-10C fits pretty well in my TR Glock 17/TLR IWB holster.  Though it's doesn't fit perfectly, it's secure enough that I've been using this holster exclusively with my P-10C for the last 1,000 rounds, including a 350 round pistol class.  Again, the holster has been excellent.

Fit my CZ P-10C too.

I'd been wanting to shoot an IDPA match with my P-10C, but the rules require a 3 o'clock holster. and mag carriers on the opposite side.  Once again, TR got the call.  Since this holster won't be used for concealed carry, I wanted something with a little more visual interest than plain black, so Tony brought out his assortment of Kydex Colors.  I placed an order for an OWB holster and "L" double mag pouch, and signed the release letting them borrow my gun to mold them.  They went over every detail with me, from what color kydex I wanted, eyelet colors, sweat shield height, belt loop size, etc.  He also couldn't wait to show me his new Sig P320 X-Five and the holster he made for it.  I also picked up some more Black Rifle Coffee K-Cups.  Tony asked if he could shoot a magazine through my P-10C and use it for photos while he had it.  Considering his preference for performance firearms, I told him to shoot as many rounds as he wanted so he could give me a good comparison to some of his high end guns.  That weekend, I ordered two more IWB "L" mag carriers from their website.  A week later, I got a Facebook message that my holster and carriers were done.

The Kryptek Raid is striking.  The grey, a few shades darker than in the photo, subdues it enough to not be obnoxious.  I left the back sides black since they're hidden against the body anyways.  The holster was little tight at first, but after a few dozen practice draws it smoothed out, about equal to my RCS Phantom.  The holster is cut very low, giving me ample space to get a master grip on the gun, but the main body extends up to completely enclose the trigger guard.  Only a small portion of the mag release is covered, and the kydex there is flared, so there's zero danger of it dropping a mag when bumped.  (I tested it by laying down on my side on top of it.)  After a few turns on the retention screw, my magazines draw smoothly from the OWB mag carrier.  The 1.5" belt loops have enough width to fit even the thickest of belts, and can be moved up or down the eyelets to adjust ride height and cant if wanted.  I can't wait to try show them off at the next IDPA match.

With a +2 extension for 17 total rounds, the IWB carriers position the mags at the same height as my Guncraft Rapid with extended Glock 19 mags and the same 17 round capacity.  While the TR carrier is a little deeper and wider, it's not deep enough to notice when I bend over and the width isn't an issue since I separate them with a belt loop.  They are molded to take advantage of the mag release notch, so even if I loosen the retention screw, there is still a slight "bump" when they click into place.  I do run them a little tighter than the OWB "L" carrier.  The metal belt clip is about 1/3 as thick as the injection molded one and twice as strong.  While I'm not worried about breaking the plastic one or having them pull free from my belt, I do like how the thinner metal clips print slightly less, even if the difference is negligible.  The hole spacing on the clip is also industry standard, making replacement easier, though I doubt I'll ever need to worry about that.

TR Holsters "K" on left, my well used Guncraft Rapid on right.

I can't say enough about how impressed I am with TR Holsters craftsmanship, attention to detail, and customer service.  If you are looking for a well made, kydex holster, with a reasonable turn-around, you cannot go wrong with TR Holsters.

Armordillo Concealment Lux V.2 Holster Review

I have a confession.  Though I've been aware of Armordillo Conealment for a while now,  I've been saying Armadillo not "Armor"dillo for the longest time.  I also never tried the original Lux.  It was only available in black, and black won't get you as many Instagram views as Kryptek.  In all seriousness, I always wanted to try a Lux.  I liked the idea of a semi-universal holster, but I already had a light-bearing IWB holster for my Glock 19.  I also didn't wait to wait four weeks for a holster that didn't seem to do anything better than what I had.  But when I bought my CZ P-10C, I finally had an excuse to purchase a Lux.  I ordered the Lux on the same day I loaned my P-10C to my local holster maker to bend me a "Gucci" IDPA rig.  I figured I'd have my P-10C back well before the Lux was ready.  To my surprise, the Lux shipped in less than a week, so I didn't have my CZ to try it with.  So I bought a second one.

I carry AIWB, and with a TLR-1 HL added, it is uncomfortable to bend over or sit for extended periods of time, especially when driving.  One way the Lux alleviates this is by mounting the belt clip low on the holster body.  By positioning the gun higher on the belt, it doesn't impede my ability to bend at the waist as much.  While I always knew it was there, I was able to keep it holstered during a 6-hour drive.  While raising the gun up should increase printing, the holster has a few features to help mitigate that.  There is a protruding ledge below the trigger guard, which uses the belt to rotate the butt of the grip inward.  It functions like the RCS Claw, but with a narrower profile.  On the body side, there is a bulge near the muzzle, which levers the grip closer to your stomach.  It also provides some deadspace between the kydex and the slide, creating some very much welcomed heat protection after holstering a hot gun.  Re-holstering without looking is no problem due to the wide weapon light channel, though I usually take a quick peek since I'm generally not in a hurry to re-holster.

Minimalist profile

Integrated "Wedge"

Concealment "Wedge"

Tuckable clip mounting holes

Getting the gun out is just as easy.  It sits high enough on the belt to get a full firing grip, and the retention is excellent.  Indexing on the light, there is a positive "click".  How tight you wear your belt will vary the amount of friction on the draw, but the initial "snap" is unchanged.  This is because unlike most holsters, the Lux isn't folded over at the sight channel, but at the bottom.  It also eliminates the need to use rivets or retention screws under the light, allowing a narrower profile.  The sight channel is open, but deep enough to accommodate suppressor height sights, and there is more than enough clearance for a red dot optic.  The holster is open at the end, allowing coverage for barrels up to 4.5" long.  The thread protector on my Glock 19's Blacklist barrel protrudes about 1/4" inch, but it isn't exposed enough to burn me.

Open sight channel accommodates tall sights.

Plenty of clearance for an optic.

The old version had a 2nd mounting hole for the belt clip, allowing for a straight draw or 15 degree cant.  The V2 has four holes, allowing forward or rearward cant, as well as adjustment to straight draw ride height. They've also added a second mounting point for a tuckable clip if you need to roll deep.  I ordered mine with the industry standard 1.5" belt clip.  It holds securely on both my leather 1.5" Ted Blocker, and 1.5" Ares Gear Aegis.  There is no danger of the holster coming out on the draw, and it prevents the holster from rotating more than a few degrees off center.

Unobstructed grip path

Thread protector peeking out about 1/4".

Conventional light bearing IWB (left) vs Lux (right)

I really can't think of any negatives with this holster.  Of course not every gun/light combo will fit, and it won't always fit as perfectly as one dedicated to a single model of handgun.  But when you take into account its multi-gun nature, the Lux V.2 offers an unmatched blend of comfort, concealability, and versatility.

It's still only available in black though.  Kryptek Raid would look so much better on Instagram.😉

CZ P-10C - 950 Rounds & Modifications

Over the weekend I shot 350 rounds at a class taught by Chris Cerino.  This brings my total round count up to 950.  I had a few issues, both user induced.  Details in the video below.

A few people had additional questions regarding the magazine release.  I outlined those here.

Finally, I replaced the factory striker spring with a Wolff 5# Glock striker spring.  Trigger weight as it stands it 5lbs 3oz.  I don't want to go any lighter since the take-up to the wall is already right at 3 pounds.

I'm loaning my P-10C to TR Holsters.com this week to have a proper kydex holster made for it.  Once I get it back, I plan to give it a 360 degree carry stipple, slightly bob the heel of the backstrap, and add Agency Arms style thumb cuts.  I have a set of P-10C Talon Grips on order to use as templates to help me outline some of the curves.  I'm going to do the same texture I did on my Glocks.  Here's what I have planned.

Update:  I loaned my P-10C to my local holster maker TR Holsters to mold a custom OWB holster and mag pouched for IDPA.  I missed it so much, I bought a second one.  The black one will be for classes and IDPA, while the FDE one will be for CCW and range practice.

2nd P-10C in FDE

CZ P-10C - Trigger Smoothing Video

With detail stripping out of the way, I moved on to slicking up the P-10C's trigger.

CZ P-10C - Detail Strip Video

Complete disassembly and reassembly of my CZ P-10C.

CZ P-10C - First Shots and Holsters

I just put 200 rounds through my newly acquired CZ P-10C.  I shot 50 rounds of American Eagle 115gr FMJ,  30 rounds of Winchester Ranger Bonded 147 JHP, 20 rounds of Winchster Ranger RA9B 147 JHP, and 100 rounds of Speer Lawman 147gr TMJ, my preferred practice ammo.  I like Speer 147 because it's inexpensive, reliable, subsonic for when I use my suppressors, and shoots similarly to my defensive loads.

I didn't clean or lube the pistol prior to shooting.  I only swapped the small backstrap for the medium sized one.  The backstrap roll pin is pretty long, longer than the shank on my Starrett 1/16" punch.   Also, the diameter is 2mm (5/64"), in between 1/16 and 3/32".  I had to be careful not to pound the 1/16" punch into the center of the pin.  I ended up using a broken 5/64 drill bit (the flat side) and a ball peen hammer to tap it the rest of the way out.

First I tested each magazine with a single round to ensure it would lock back on empty.  Then I tried to induce a limp-wristing failure with the 115gr.  I figured a one-finger grip, relaxed wrist, and light practice load would give me the best chance at a failure.  I shot each magazine loaded with five rounds in this way.  I had zero failures.

Reloads are relatively easy.  The top of the magazine is narrow with a long taper, and there's no over-insertion shelf like on the Glock to get hung up.  The backstrap acts like a Glock grip plug, a ramp that guides the rear of the magazine into the well.  The mags eject very positively, springing from the gun even when held horizontal at slide lock.  The gun will "auto-forward" the slide if you slam the mag in hard enough at the right angle, but I couldn't do it consistently.  I prefer the Opposing Forces Reload method anyway.  It's not as easy as it could be sue to the stiffness of the slide release though.  The mag release is also still pretty stiff, but the location under thumb makes it easy to get a solid press.  The mag popped free every time I went for the button.  I did have a few failures to lock back on empty during the accuracy tests when my thumb would touch the slide release.  I think it's because I using a weaker grip to minimize sight movement, because outside of shooting groups, I didn't have any issues.

Next I moved the target back to 25, 50, and 75 feet and shot 5-shot groups unsupported with all four ammo types.  Shooting for maximum accuracy, and squeezing the trigger as slowly as I could, the trigger felt heavier than during dryfire.  I'm sure someone will make a heavier set of trigger springs to lighten the break weight a la Glock.  Point of aim for the 25 and 50 foot groups was the bulls eye.  I was having trouble seeing the red dot at 75', so I used a 6 o'clock hold.  Here they are below.

25' Groups

50' Groups

75' Groups

Finally, I burned my remaining ammo shooting 3-5 shot strings at 25 feet, and strong/weak hand only at 15 on a BC-27 target.  The guns shoots soft and very flat.  I can't really compare the recoil scientifically, but I'd say the gun recoils like a Glock 17 with a heavy guide rod.  The trigger is bugging me a bit though.  The trigger safety blade is flat, and doesn't recess flush with the rest of the trigger face.  If you've ever shot a stock G19 or G26 trigger for a while, you've probably experienced the raw spot that forms on your trigger finger pad.  The trigger safety has a date with some sand paper as do the grips.  The aggressive texture is unforgiving of a weak grip.  Every try to twist off a beer bottle cap that isn't a twist off?  That's how my hands felt after the limp-wrist test.  I definitely see stippling in the guns future.

25' Rapid

15' One-Handed

Speaking of changes, there's not much else I can think to change.  I plan to do a full detail strip and cleaning.  While I'm at it, I'm going to see if I can smooth out the trigger interface surfaces a bit as well as the mag and slide releases.  I also want to see if there's enough frame material to do "Agency" cuts in the frame.  Having access to a vertical mill is awesome.

While it's too soon to make any conclusion about reliability and durability, I'm pretty confident that CZ has made a winner.  While I won't be selling my Glocks and Glock paraphernalia, I doubt I'll be buying any more.

CZ made it a point that the P-10C was compatible with holsters for "popular" handguns, namely the Glock 19.  I've amassed quite a few Glock holsters and unfortunately, only a few would adequately secure the P-10C.

Yes:
TR Holsters IWB G17 w/ TLR
TR Holsters RTI w/ Lvl II Retention for G17 w/ RMR and X300U-A/B

Yes with issues:
Raven Concealment Eidolon G19- Friction fit only, doesn't "click" into place
JM Custom IWB G19 - Tight, had to back off the retention screw

No:
Priority-1 IWB G19
Raven Concealment Vanguard II Glock
Comp-Tac Flatline G19
Guncraft Cloak G19
Guncraft Cloak Mod2 G19
G-Code OSL for G17 w/ X300U-B